Key Largo -- Is it noir?

[Steve-O]

I watched Key Largo again tonight. I love that movie and I've seen it a number of times since I was a kid.

My question, do you consider it film noir? and why?

http://www.screenfanatic.com/images/bacall31.jpg

[Davidmk]

It's a good question i ponder Myself , I kinda almost lump it in with Noir in my collection , Love the movie , it's not really as Dark as most noir , but i guess it has some aspects to it ...... It Does have a ganster in the Noir man Edward G. Robinson & it did have some twists i did not see coming when i 1st had seen the film .....

[Haggai]

I think it's probably a bit on the outside of being noir. The script is essentially an update of The Petrified Forest, with a helping of Casablanca thrown in via Bogart's "I stick my neck out for nobody" character who eventually comes around to helping others in need. I love Key Largo, but I don't quite see it as noir...which of its characters are in a situation that could be described as noir? Maybe Claire Trevor's character comes the closest, but it's a supporting role.

[Fast Eddie]

You'd never think of it as noir if you read the source: Maxwell Anderson's KEY LARGO: A Play in a Prologue and Two Acts, written in 1939. Political allegory, with the prologue set in Spain during the civil war. Incredibly arch, real 1930s progressive theater stuff. The story I heard was that Huston bought the right and he and Richard Brooks decided to make it to pay off their gambling debts. They tacked on the end of the book TO HAVE AND HAVE NOT as their finish, and needless to say dropped all the political stuff, making McCloud a WWII vet instead of one of the Lincoln Brigade.

It doesn't seem like noir because the characters are so cut-and-dried. Robinson is the villain, his henchman have no character, and everyone else is noble. No temptation, no switching of allegiances, no moral uncertainties. Not to say it's not fun to watch! Here's my question: Did Bacall ever play a genuinely interesting character during this phase of her career? She's got something special, to be sure, but it seems to me the characters are utterly one-dimensional.

[Harry Fabian]

*SPOILERS* (just in case)

This film tries to sell the happy ending with all the bad guys being killed and Bogie and Bacall getting together-but I don't buy it. This really is not a happy ending, with a lot of tragedy that won't easily be overcome: the murder of the deputy, the killings of the Osceola brothers, and the giant rift caused by leaving the (Seminoles?) outside exposed to the hurricane. I've seen happier endings in movies that are generally considered noir. They have a lot of healing to do in Key Largo after we leave the scene. Forgive me if my memory fails, but I don't see how this is film less "noirish" than say, "Suddenly" or "The Desperate Hours" - which I have seen on noir lists (I've seen the films, too).

Certainly all the major characters, except Bogie are portrayed as all good or all bad-no real conflict. What is Bogart's conflict? He wasn't afraid to die when giving Claire Trevor a drink. Did he somehow find courage after a failed moment when he refused to shoot it out with Johnny Rocco? I don't see a point shown in the movie where that transformation could have occurred. Perhaps he was flashing back to the war and felt that Bacall and Barrymore were his troops on the line and that he was protecting them by refusing to shoot it out with Rocco. And perhaps he thought that the risk was only to him if he gave Trevor the drink? If so, that betrays a certain fatalism in the leading man, who up that point was spending all his time cleverly trying to avoid getting anyone killed by Rocco.I've seen the film maybe 5 times and I don't know what was going on in Bogie's head.

I recently said that it's not my favorite thing to discuss borderline movies and try to place them firmly "in" or "out" of the noir box. I think there all valid points on both sides of the discussion. However, with the really conflicted ending, a possibly tormented male lead, the gangster element, and the presence of so many noir icons, I would lean toward calling this noir. Not the bleakest or the most depressing of noir, but if you leave this movie feeling 100% happy, maybe you haven't been paying attention. I do think we probably would all agree this is a great film that everyone should see-regardless of interest in noir.

[Hard-Boiled-Rick]

Nope. Straight-out gangster flick with a sunny ending. Hollywood schmaltz in the Keys.

[Hart]

I think The Treasure of the Sierra Madre is closer to noir in spirit and style than Key Largo.

[Hard-Boiled-Rick]

You'd never think of it as noir if you read the source: Maxwell Anderson's KEY LARGO: A Play in a Prologue and Two Acts, written in 1939. Political allegory, with the prologue set in Spain during the civil war. Incredibly arch, real 1930s progressive theater stuff. The story I heard was that Huston bought the right and he and Richard Brooks decided to make it to pay off their gambling debts. They tacked on the end of the book TO HAVE AND HAVE NOT as their finish, and needless to say dropped all the political stuff, making McCloud a WWII vet instead of one of the Lincoln Brigade.

It doesn't seem like noir because the characters are so cut-and-dried. Robinson is the villain, his henchman have no character, and everyone else is noble. No temptation, no switching of allegiances, no moral uncertainties. Not to say it's not fun to watch! Here's my question: Did Bacall ever play a genuinely interesting character during this phase of her career? She's got something special, to be sure, but it seems to me the characters are utterly one-dimensional.

About your question regarding Miss Bacall…

Lauren Bacall is one helluva a hot looking dame, but her four movie appearances with Bogart seemed strained. She’s a beautiful mannequin for sure, but…well that’s it.

Now, if I had me pick, I’d rather spend the night being taken or shaken down by Claire Trevor, Barbara Stanwyck, Linda Darnell, or Marie Windsor characters. They would be much more emotionally and intellectually adventurous and satisfying. Woe is me… the sweets of noir.

[Davidmk]

About your question regarding Miss Bacall…

Lauren Bacall is one helluva a hot looking dame, but her four movie appearances with Bogart seemed strained. She’s a beautiful mannequin for sure, but…well that’s it.

Now, if I had me pick, I’d rather spend the night being taken or shaken down by Claire Trevor, Barbara Stanwyck, Linda Darnell, or Marie Windsor characters. They would be much more emotionally and intellectually adventurous and satisfying. Woe is me… the sweets of noir.


I Do agree with this quite a bit , i will say that In Dark passage that stiffness/ strained really added to it for me & worked .

[eubiecat]

Like THE MALTESE FALCON, KEY LARGO is really not a film noir. Both films traffic in the trappings of noir, but they lack that certain something that defines what noir is to me.

They're crime pictures, and in LARGO's case, a gangster picture, but they don't feel noir to me. Not in the way that ASPHALT JUNGLE feels utterly noir in its outlook, characters and its story arc.

They're all great movies.

I think a neat thread here might be "Sorta-Noirs," a forum discussion of movies that aaaaaaaaalllllmmmmoooosssttt are noirs, but don't drop the nickel all the way. Noir is a state of mind, and, as such, is subjective. But many movies flirt with the feeling while never surrendering themselves to it.

[JCharles]

I'm a lover of Key Largo, as well, I can remember first seeing it as a kid and many times since. I think it's a film noir of the tropical variety and it has loads of what Raymond Chandler called "The Smell of Fear". The tension in the hotel is palpably hot and claustrophobic and there is fear engendered in the beating of the policeman, the murder of the Osceola brothers, and Edward G's reaction to the hurricane. Towards the end of the film when they are on the boat, Bogart is isolated and alone versus the gangsters and the elements.
Two scenes always stick out for me as being very noir: the first shot of Edward G. Robinson in the bathtub with cigar and fan, just full of menace (THAT made a big impression on me as a kid!) and secondly, the expression on Bogart's face right after he has gunned down Edward G. He has a clear moment of disgust and loathing at the whole sordid business and having to kill someone again. For him at that point, the war lasted a bit longer.

[Steve-O]

I was stuck in a Key Largo weather situation in FLA all of last week only to have my flight canceled because the storm moved up to the NE. It took me days to get home... and I couldn't get on BAN with the hotel/airport computers.

I did want to chime in about Bacall.

I think she wasn't the strongest actress but was super hot so that made up for it. You can see how stiff she is in Key Largo from the clip I posted. However, I find her just right in Dark Passage and The Big Sleep. She became a good actress as the years went on.